Intersubjective Reality LO2275

Doug Seeley (
31 Jul 95 03:35:32 EDT

Responding to John Palmer in LO2261 and LO2262...

Thanks for sharing your background on this issue John.... here are some
thoughts which emerge for me while reading your postings, and how I think
this subject is relevant to learning organizations.

In a sense I feel that I was mis-leading in presenting the track of the
influences which helped me come to an "intersubjective" position. These
influences helped me to find an articulation of it, but they did not "do
it for me". What did, was some very intense growth and meditation work
some 15 years ago. For a long time I had held a similar position to the
falsification criterion which Popper had put forward, refusing to accept
anything which required me believe in some position 'a priori'. However,
I discovered that I had been framing the falsification position from a
strictly objective scientific position. While railing against people
imposing belief structures on me, I had been accepting a subtle, but very
strong belief in the laws of physics and an "objective space-time" where
they got played out, and where falsification could be done. I had been
imposing this authority upon my reality, and hence not open to the
possible truth of an intersubjective reality.

When I discovered for myself that truth could be "known directly" without
the imposition of any medium or process (i.e. from the objective
space-time bias above), a tremendous shift in orientation occured for me
which is still going on. Becoming aware of the creation of my own reality
however was one thing, the next stage was factoring in that others were
doing the same. "Knowing" that others were doing this was for me, a result
of "directly knowing", or gnosis of, them. Hence, there became for me,
this vast, intersubjective co-creation of reality going on. [By the way,
for me it is both interSubjective and intraSubjective.] It is this
co-creation aspect which I feel is particularly relevant for learning

For me, it is out of such interSubjective co-creation that the "true
stories" of an organization emerge (as they do for families and other
communities). By acknowledging the participation of everyone in the
construction of the truths and myths of a corporate culture, we open the
doors to awareness, personal power and effective change. Working with the
emergence of these co-creations appears to be much more effective, than
working with an assumed "objective" position which for me seems only to
lead to "angels on the head of a pin" type discussions over which
authoritative, conceptual framework to impose upon the situation.

By honoring each participants contribution to such co-creation, not only
are we contributing to an environment which encourages their empowerment,
but in a very real manner taking our own personal power. My resistance to
getting to such a position has been a disdain, even fear of the imposition
of authority by the belief systems and subjectivity of others. When I
realized that such fear came from my own beliefs, I became more free, and
opened up to the interSubjective co-creation. I wonder whether any others
have had this experience of co-creation within organization or community
(event the LO list?) and how to work with it?

P.S. I acknowledge that the story-telling thread was addressing this
issue in part.

Doug Seeley:		InterDynamics Pty. Ltd. (Australia) in Geneva,
			Compuserve: 100433.133  or FAX   41 22 756 3957